Feds allege coaches bribed for school admission

Discussion in 'NorCal Scene' started by psyclone, Mar 12, 2019.

  1. SpeedK1llz

    SpeedK1llz Member

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    I find it hard to believe that somebody on the UCLA women’s coaching staff wasn’t complicit in the scam. How does a random girl with little soccer experience get issued a jersey, pose for a picture and get featured on the team web site and in the media guide and nobody knows about it? The 50 parents who got caught are just the tip of the iceberg. I’m sure the feds are chasing down every family that paid Key Worldwide Foundation any amount of money.
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  2. Restauranteur

    Restauranteur New Member

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    WTF is wrong with you? You’ve hidden behind a pseudonym to repeatedly use this forum to trash children who’ve worked hard for and deserve all of their accomplishments, and now you’re insinuating that their parents and coaches of committing felonies. You need to immediately retract your statements and apologize, or you need to stand behind your comments and identify yourself.
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  3. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    I totally agree with what you are saying and the people you mentioned are spot on. I don't know why your boss D_K would want you to take it down and even more so you listened.

    Lets be real here. The scams that's been reported in the news lately have been going on for YEARS at the youth soccer level. Until the NCAA cuts all ties between college coaches coaching club teams this/these shenanigans will continue to occur.
  4. dk_b

    dk_b Well-Known Member

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    I asked @ECNL to take down her comment because we are still discussing minor children (unlike Loughlin's kids or the young woman who was on the UCLA roster for a season). I've been pretty consistent on these pages that I (i) don't give "thumbs down" because if I disagree with a comment, I prefer explaining why (if I cannot or am unwilling to explain "why", it'd be ch1ckensh1t of me to hide behind a button) and (ii) think it really inappropriate for there to be negative posts that can identify specific kids and that comment drew a pretty clear roadmap. None of these kids is a public figure and there's a big difference between knocking some ideas around with your friends and making a public post on a bulletin board. Given my consistency, I don't think I needed to explain why I'd want her to take it down because I figured it was obvious. And as is obvious by your post, you disagree with my opinion. Opinions say a lot about the opinion-haver and I'm happy to stand behind mine. [edited to remove disrespectful snark]

    I appreciate that ECNL did take down the comment and I think it is funny you'd refer to me as her boss, especially since I have no clue who she is and I doubt she knows me. Calling me her boss is comical and seems disrespectful of her ability to make her own decisions. But it's a helluva turn of a phase.
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  5. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    The conversation shifted from talking about their children to talking about how local college coaches get paid thousands of dollars to "train" players and then somehow these kids that are mediocre are getting into these prestigious schools with a "roster" spot. Coincidental? Yah could be. But all of us know which kids are looking at what schools and what schools are recurring X and Y kids. So when you hear of a kid that is not on anyone's radar going to said school with a roster spot, one just has to scratch their head and point to where the money is. Ahhh...that's how it is. In the business world a lot of what goes down is who you know, not what you know.

    in regards to outing kids, it's not rocket science and if you're on any ECNL/GDA/any higher level soccer team you knows whats going on. Nepotism at it's finest. Again, I know you're a loyalist to your club (and I think very highly of your club and daughter-she's a great player) but I just don't agree with the politics that goes on there. If you want to message offline about it more, I'm totally open to it as I have always liked your posts
  6. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    sorry if I offended you golfing buddy. What did I say that was so wrong? Did I name coaches, clubs, players? I'm asking a legitimate question. How is it that kids who are not on ANY coaches radar, get into prestigious universities with roster spots? Has this not been in the news lately? I am not accusing anyone of anything and actually stating facts. The fact that you're so offended leads me to believe that there's more to my question.

    (THIS IS PURE EXAMPLE) if my kid's trainer is the head coach at, let's say, the university of North Carolina and we've paid him 100.00 an hour for 5 years, 4 days a week (you do the math). she's an okay player, on a few mid-major watchlists, but somehow gets a roster spot at UNC, don't you think that should pose a red flag? If you don't think so then you're just as guilty as the people who are getting away or running these Ponzi schemes.
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  7. psyclone

    psyclone Member

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    No, I don't. And here is why:

    A typical college roster is about thirty spots, and every single one of them have players who will never see the field, ever. Not on even on senior night. They are useful for practice, and scrimmaging, and that is about it. These are not desirable slots, and keeping them filled year to year, even for strong programs, is pretty hard.

    If a coach know a player is passably good, but more importantly, reliable, willing to put in the work, familiar with your system, OK with that role (and most importantly, able to bring up the team's collective GPA), then of course you would want to take her. You need a special relationship with a player to sort that sort of thing out though.

    Which isn't to say that crazy things don't happen in the world of college sports--they absolutely do. But there is room for these sorts of arrangements.
  8. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    Okay, I feel ya on what you're saying. The only thing that I will agree to disagree is that at prestigious schools (UCLA, Stanford, Cal, Ivy leagues) they are desirable slots. they're desirable because of how much MORE earning potential you can have with a degree from Said university as opposed to another. We know kids who have zero chance to play at a couple of Pac-12 schools (they were also offered scholarships) in the first two years and because they're national level teams, may not play much junior and senior years. That being said, they're going to these schools because of the academics. Would you rather your kid to to UCLA or a state school? Stanford or Cal State LA? So I can see where a roster spot is MUCH more than just a spot on a team. it's a distinct advantage for whoever gets it for the rest of their life (at higher level schools).
  9. LivingTheDream

    LivingTheDream Member

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    If there is such an arraignment/side door access - getting zero playing time is miserable; being a student athlete adding value to the team and college is a true college experience. Being an outsider w a special arrangement knowing the water person will interact more w the team and coaches sounds horrible - if all these girls train countless hours to play this game I’m sure most would like to be competitive and feel like their part of a team not a line rider and towel person. I get your in the colllege (living through the kid) but not being in the trenches D1/2 or 3 w your team is a miserable college experience.
  10. Restauranteur

    Restauranteur New Member

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    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  11. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    LOL okay if you think so. ;). If you've read my earlier posts, I told you guys early on my daughter was an 00 kid that played for De Anza. But if you want to think that I'm who you say I am, that's cool. Again, I asked a legitimate question and one that YOU haven't responded too.
  12. linuxredhat

    linuxredhat Member

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    Ugh..let the hating begin. All these comments about "But all of us know which kids are looking at what schools..." How do "all of us know" unless we're the coach or the player? Once the scandal published the gossip and nasty assumptions are running rampant. A comment from a parent I overheard recently is typical: "I knew there was no way that School X would be interested in so-and-so. Her parents are super wealthy, it all makes sense now."

    (NOTE: the following rant is not addressed to anyone on this forum): Since the scandal, I've had so many parents without kids in sports (or kids at all) says this proves that admission should be based on academics alone. The assumption being that athletes are getting in solely due to their athletic ability and are otherwise dumb as a box of rocks. I've tried to counter that argument with several points. #1) Kids with perfect SAT scores and sky-high GPA's are a dime a dozen when you talk about elite schools so you can't simply look at grades/test scores alone. #2) Just because a kid is an athlete doesn't mean he/she isn't also a very good student and didn't have to work his/her butt off to maintain a high GPA. And they have to do this despite all the time they have to devote to their sport. It's much like having a job, it's time away from studying. #3). Do we really want such a one-dimensional student base in that we have kids who spend all their time focused on studying? What about kids who get in due to another non-academic talent like music? Does that mean they are dumb too? Yes, athletes need to have the academic chops to make it at whatever school they commit to but don't automatically assume they don't. It is possible to be both athletic and smart.

    It all gets so tiring. This crap has been going on forever, the wealthy buying their kids a spot, it just this time they got caught. But how successful do you think those kids are going to be if their parents are constantly propping them up and removing all obstacles from their path? One of my kids went to CC and transferred to a top UC school, another is at a CC and will transfer to a State school, my last one committed to a top 4-year college. All will be fine and no one is going to give a rat's *ss which kid graduated from where.
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  13. bhodi

    bhodi Member

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    I could not agree enough with you last paragraph. Out of all of the new college grads I've hired in the past 10 years, the top performer out of all of them graduated from a State school that has a reputation as a party school. He outperformed all of the others by a longshot, many of whom came from what people would consider top academic schools including Ivies, Stanford, Cal, UCLA, USC, etc. His career is flying sky high, while a few of those from those well known schools have already flamed out. Graduating from one of those schools may help with getting some connections and getting your foot in the door, but once you start your career nobody gives a sh!t what diploma you have on your wall. Either you're capable and willing to put in the extra effort to do the work to advance, or you're not willing and get surpassed. I've seen it over and over again in my line of work. We do our kids a disservice by spreading the message that there is only one academic path to success.
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  14. dk_b

    dk_b Well-Known Member

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    "one academic path to success" - whether that is in the school or the major or the timing. I agree with you - not every path is the same (thank goodness). And one of the hardest things for even the most supportive of parents is to really, REALLY, step back and allow it to be the kid's path, not the parents' path (and I think that that is one of the roots of the current scandal - all about the parents and their egos in telling their cocktail party peers that their child is at X school). We can, and should, guide (which sometimes includes pushing a bit) but we need to let them control. Well, at least I think we need to do that. It is hard enough for everyone - kids and parents - that pushing the kid to follow a path that is not his or her own is a mighty recipe for potential disaster.
  15. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    There's another message board that I follow and they're talking about the same things. One poster made a good point about student-athletes. they said that there's a case study that was done a few years ago about Coach Mike Krzyzewski from Duke and how it was a middle of the road university and in the early 80's when Coach K took over, the ENTIRE profile of the school changed. why? Because they started winning and the perception of the school changed in the eyes of everyone. Now Duke is a top academic school with great sports programs all around. This wasn't the case back in the 80's.

    Administrators know that it's all about public perception. If you increase the profile of your school, you get more applicants, more donations, a higher ranking.
  16. LivingTheDream

    LivingTheDream Member

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  17. linuxredhat

    linuxredhat Member

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    Yep, same experience in my line of work. I don't have a college degree, I started out in an hourly position and worked my way up. I've had people with top degrees who couldn't troubleshoot their way out of a cardboard box (I'm in IT). One of the best IT guys I ever worked with was a guy who started out at the helpdesk. He only had a high school diploma but he could get to the root of a problem while the rest of us were still trying to remember what directory the error logs were in. I'm not saying that college degrees aren't very important, that's why all 3 of my kids are getting their college degree, simply that--as you stated--it's all about whether or not you put the work in and can do the job. So if in my case it ultimately didn't matter whether I had a college degree or not, it certainly shouldn't matter where your college degree is from.

    All of that being said it was a real eye-opener the competition for getting into colleges these days. The UC's are crazy hard to get into as a freshman, so much easier to transfer via the TAG program. The State college my son is going to transfer to has several majors that are "impacted" (too many applicants, not enough slots). I don't know the answer, but it shouldn't be this difficult. That is what sets up the situation like the recent scandal.
  18. linuxredhat

    linuxredhat Member

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  19. soccercritique

    soccercritique Member

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    Well not only that but that if you don't go to said school, you won't ever be successful in that field. In certain professions I would say getting a degree from School A is much more reputable than gettin it from school B and in the long run "could" get you more earning power. For a lot of jobs that require an MA, that where it's at. Go to undergrad wherever, and rock it....but then again, as most of you said in the professional world, it's who you know...
  20. linuxredhat

    linuxredhat Member

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    Here's a great article on whether Undergraduate "brand name" matters for graduate school. It includes links to Harvard Business School, Harvard Law School, and Yale Law School and what their undergraduate school representation is. Arizona State is listed in all 3 (I only mention Arizona State because one of the dad's who paid to have his daughter go to USC made that comment about "I don't want her ending up somewhere like Arizona State"). So, as you said, those professions where the school you went to might matter are probably only going to care about where you went to graduate school, not undergrad.

    https://www.collegetransitions.com/...duate-school-does-undergraduate-brand-matter/

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